Inkscape Wiki - User contributions [en]

Printing consensus poll

2005-12-14T13:12:17Z

BrandonCsSanders: lot's of refactoring

== Problem ==

Bryce has pointed out the #1 feature need for Inkscape right now is strong support for Adobe Portable Document Format (PDF) and Postscript (PS) in his [http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=36054&max_rows=25&style=flat&viewmonth=200511&viewday=30 2005.11.30 email] to the Inkscape mailing lists.
This ConsensusPoll exists to enable the community to efficiently create and commit to a plan of action to resolve this issue.

== Contract ==

* >= 20 inkscape enthusiasts
* >= 4 developers with commit access
* >= 95% yes
* all conditions in plan are met
* 72 hour GO timer
* 80% cloture

ContractExplanation

Because this contract defines what it means to participate in this poll it will never be changed. If it turns out to be inadequate, this poll must be canceled and a new poll with a new contract must be drafted.

== Yes-No Poll ==

Participation in this poll is open to anyone who wants to participate.

Voting yes in this poll means that you believe the community created plan is ready for implementation, and that you will do your part to support its execution. Voting no in this poll means that you have outstanding concerns about the community created plan. You can change your vote at any time. All votes are transparent so that those voting yes can listen to the concerns of those voting no.

No ... BrandonCsSanders - Success needs to be defined (e.g., if all 20 test cases are passed ...)
No ... BryceHarrington - I will pledge $50 once someone defines how we do pledges :-)
No ... AlexandreProkoudine - There is no plan yet
No ... ColinMarquardt - There is no plan yet
No ... EricWilhelm - The plan needs salt
No ... MenTaLguY - This isn't much of a plan...
No ... JonCruz - Plan? Not quite yet
No ... JonPhillips - no plan...
No ... NicuBuculei - so far the plan is weak
No ... RalfWStephan - isolated thoughts don't make a plan, pledge 5% of SoC money amount used for it
No ... AndyFitzsimon - I will also pledge $50 once someone defines how we do pledges.
No ... TuukkaPasanen - There isn't good plan yet.

(If you are voting no because the plan is incomplete, please describe what you'd like to see added or changed.)

== Pledges ==

$50 ... BryceHarrington - I will pledge $50 once someone defines how we do pledges :-)
$50 ... AndyFitzsimon - I will also pledge $50 once someone defines how we do pledges.
??? ... RalfWStephan - pledge 5% of SoC money amount used for it (how much is this?)
$50 ... BrandonCsSanders - once the plan is done

== Plan ==

# Describe the [[Current PDF Support]]
# Identify [[Required PDF Support]]
# Assemble a few dozen examples to use as [[PDF test cases]]
# Document how each of the current existing projects (potential starting points) performs on the suite of test cases
# Determine timeframe
## Start some time in early 2006?
## Expected completion some time in mid/late 2006?
# Select developer with the right skillset
## C/C++, XML
## PDF file format
## SVG file format
## Able to work under (U.S.) contract
## /Other skillset requirements?/
# Determine what funding is needed to enable them to complete the work
# Establish a contract with the selected developer to perform the work
# When the developer is done, verify that all test cases pass, then pay developer

== Background Information ==

* [[SOC_Original_Project_Prompts]]
* PrintingSubsystem
* [[Roadmap]] (Milestone 11) Import/Export Feature Enhancements

== Adequate Technical Solutions ==

What solutions would be fine?
* Library that integrates directly in to inkscape (and scribus, ...)
** Use [[Cairo]] as the presentation layer and use its support for pdf/ps
*** See [http://poppler.freedesktop.org/ Poppler] for PDF import.
*** This may be a first step towards an eventual migration of the backend renderer to Cairo
** Pull out the scribus pdf support into a libpdf that can be shared by both scribus and Inkscape
*** Requires conversion of Qt-isms into more neutral widgetset-independent style
* Extend an existing standalone (filter) tool that can be bundled with inkscape
** [http://scratchcomputing.com/projects/uber-converter/ Uberconverter]
** [http://www.solidcode.net/pdf2svg/ pdf2svg]
** [http://www.sodipodi.com/index.php3?section=download/tools ill2svg]
** [http://www.xs4all.nl/~hanwen/public/software/ai2svg.py ai2svg]
** [http://www.accesspdf.com/pdftk/ pdftk]

== Possible Strategies ==

* Raise money and hire a developer to implement it
** Collect pledges, once we are over threshold collect funds (http://fundable.org/)
*** What should the threshhold be? $2000? $5000?
*** Still too early to decide what the threshold should be. We need to know how much it will cost first.
** Need to decide what the funds would be spent on ahead of time
*** 10-20% - Tester to collect test cases and put together a test suite for developer to use
*** 70-80% - Developer to write the code, document it, and make it pass the tests
*** 5-10% - Liaison to handle the paperwork, collect/distribute funds, track/report progress, and verify the work has been completed adequately
** Mercenaries that would do this for us?
*** BrandonCsSanders ... I'd do it for $2000, half up front, half once it meets spec. Caveat: it would take me six months to complete because my plate is pretty full right now and I'll be snatching a week here and a week there.
*** EricWilhelm ... This will be a lovely fit for the UberConverter. I'm guessing $5k would get it to about the same level as XAR and SVG in chromista. Caveat: Those aren't done yet. Check back in Jan. I would also be happy to oversee/direct the work of someone else wanting to write this as a pair of UberConverter connectors (crs2pdf, pdf2crs.)
*** /other mercenaries?/
* Hold a [http://www.usemod.com/cgi-bin/mb.pl?BarnRaising BarnRaising]
** at [http://RecentChangesCamp.org RecentChangesCamp] in Portland February 3-5
** other location/time?
* Wait for a volunteer to get inspired and just do it

== Questions/Brainstorms ==

* What about what inkscape earned through the Google Summer of Code? What's the status of this?
** $2000 earned; there has been no plan or consensus for what to use it for
* Does Cairo have PDF export already? What about to use cairo for just this job? and later then use cairo for the whole presentation layer? Instead of creating an interims solution?
** Yes, Cairo has PDF export capabilities; it's unknown if it's significantly better than our current (poor) pdf export functionality
** Cairo Postscript and PDF backends are still experimental and disabled by default in current stable release, but plan is to make them supported in next stable release, expected for the end of 2005. See [http://cvs.cairographics.org/*checkout*/cairo/ROADMAP Cairo ROADMAP]
** A way to test cairo capabilities would be to use librsvg HEAD. See Dom Lachowicz [http://www.advogato.org/person/cinamod/diary.html?start=91 blog entry].
* Investigate ps2ai, pstoedit and ai2svg conversion options (potential EPS support?)
* Import of native Adobe Illustrator files, which have been PDF based since Illustrator 10 (at least).
* Other RFE's related to Import or Export?
* Add extension for use of [http://vdxtosvg.sourceforge.net/ VDX2SVG]
** (This is an unrelated file format... -- Bryce)
* UberConverter

* I'd like to suggest looking at Xpdf or ghostview as possible bases to build a pdftosvg tool with. They both come with command line tools to convert pdf files to other formats. - Ulf Erikson
** This is what we do currently iirc - Bryce
** Uh, okay. I must have missed that. What tool do you use? I know about [http://www.solidcode.net/pdf2svg/ pdf2svg], [http://www.sodipodi.com/index.php3?section=download/tools ill2svg] and [http://www.xs4all.nl/~hanwen/public/software/ai2svg.py ai2svg]. Neither seem to be based on a pdf reader/viewer. I have never tried the (Windows only?) SVG plugin for [http://www.pstoedit.net/pstoedit pstoedit] and the [http://www.eprg.org/projects/SVG/ps2svg/ ps2svg] SVG driver for Ghostscript doesn't seem to be available at all. Anyway, I see now that you list [http://poppler.freedesktop.org/ Poppler] (which a pdf library based on Xpdf) as something worth looking at, so I guess you can remove my comment all together. Let me know if you wish to try my Xpdf code with Poppler. - Ulf (Could we not use the mailing list for discussions?)

Printing consensus poll

2005-12-14T13:05:28Z

BrandonCsSanders: *

== Problem ==

Bryce has pointed out the #1 feature need for Inkscape right now is strong support for Adobe Portable Document Format (PDF) and Postscript (PS) in his [http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=36054&max_rows=25&style=flat&viewmonth=200511&viewday=30 2005.11.30 email] to the Inkscape mailing lists.
This ConsensusPoll exists to enable the community to efficiently create and commit to a plan of action to resolve this issue.

== Contract ==

* >= 20 inkscape enthusiasts
* >= 4 developers with commit access
* >= 95% yes
* all conditions in plan are met
* 72 hour GO timer
* 80% cloture

ContractExplanation

Because this contract defines what it means to participate in this poll it will never be changed. If it turns out to be inadequate, this poll must be canceled and a new poll with a new contract must be drafted.

== Yes-No Poll ==

Participation in this poll is open to anyone who wants to participate.

Voting yes in this poll means that you believe the community created plan is ready for implementation, and that you will do your part to support its execution. Voting no in this poll means that you have outstanding concerns about the community created plan. You can change your vote at any time. All votes are transparent so that those voting yes can listen to the concerns of those voting no.

No ... BrandonCsSanders - Success needs to be defined (e.g., if all 20 test cases are passed ...)
No ... BryceHarrington - I will pledge $50 once someone defines how we do pledges :-)
No ... AlexandreProkoudine - There is no plan yet
No ... ColinMarquardt - There is no plan yet
No ... EricWilhelm - The plan needs salt
No ... MenTaLguY - This isn't much of a plan...
No ... JonCruz - Plan? Not quite yet
No ... JonPhillips - no plan...
No ... NicuBuculei - so far the plan is weak
No ... RalfWStephan - isolated thoughts don't make a plan, pledge 5% of SoC money amount used for it
No ... AndyFitzsimon - I will also pledge $50 once someone defines how we do pledges.
No ... TuukkaPasanen - There isn't good plan yet.

(If you are voting no because the plan is incomplete, please describe what you'd like to see added or changed.)

== Pledges ==

$50 ... BryceHarrington - I will pledge $50 once someone defines how we do pledges :-)
$50 ... AndyFitzsimon - I will also pledge $50 once someone defines how we do pledges.
??? ... RalfWStephan - pledge 5% of SoC money amount used for it (how much is this?)
$50 ... BrandonCsSanders - once the plan is done

== Plan ==

# Describe the [[Current PDF Support]]
# Identify [[Required PDF Support]]
# Assemble a few dozen examples to use as [[PDF test cases]]
# Document how each of the current existing projects (potential starting points) performs on the suite of test cases
# Determine timeframe
## Start some time in early 2006?
## Expected completion some time in mid/late 2006?
# Select developer with the right skillset
## C/C++, XML
## PDF file format
## SVG file format
## Able to work under (U.S.) contract
## /Other skillset requirements?/
# Determine what funding is needed to enable them to complete the work
# Establish a contract with the selected developer to perform the work
# When the developer is done, verify that all test cases pass, then pay developer

== Background Information ==

* [[SOC_Original_Project_Prompts]]
* PrintingSubsystem
* [[Roadmap]] (Milestone 11) Import/Export Feature Enhancements

== Adequate Technical Solutions ==

What solutions would be fine?
* Library that integrates directly in to inkscape (and scribus, ...)
* Standalone pdf2svg, svg2pdf, ... filter scripts that can be bundled with inkscape
*

(Brandon - what is this section for? -- Bryce)

== Possible Strategies ==

* Raise money and hire a developer to implement it
** Collect pledges, once we are over threshold collect funds (http://fundable.org/)
*** What should the threshhold be? $2000? $5000?
*** Still too early to decide what the threshold should be. We need to know how much it will cost first.
** Need to decide what the funds would be spent on ahead of time
*** 10-20% - Tester to collect test cases and put together a test suite for developer to use
*** 70-80% - Developer to write the code, document it, and make it pass the tests
*** 5-10% - Liaison to handle the paperwork, collect/distribute funds, track/report progress, and verify the work has been completed adequately
** Mercenaries that would do this for us?
*** BrandonCsSanders ... I'd do it for $2000, half up front, half once it meets spec. Caveat: it would take me six months to complete because my plate is pretty full right now and I'll be snatching a week here and a week there.
*** EricWilhelm ... This will be a lovely fit for the UberConverter. I'm guessing $5k would get it to about the same level as XAR and SVG in chromista. Caveat: Those aren't done yet. Check back in Jan. I would also be happy to oversee/direct the work of someone else wanting to write this as a pair of UberConverter connectors (crs2pdf, pdf2crs.)
*** /other mercenaries?/
* Use [[Cairo]] as the presentation layer and use its support for pdf/ps
** See [http://poppler.freedesktop.org/ Poppler] for PDF import.
** This may be a first step towards an eventual migration of the backend renderer to Cairo
* Pull out the scribus pdf support into a libpdf that can be shared by both scribus and Inkscape
** Requires conversion of Qt-isms into more neutral widgetset-independent style
* Extend an existing standalone (filter) tool
** [http://scratchcomputing.com/projects/uber-converter/ Uberconverter]
** [http://www.solidcode.net/pdf2svg/ pdf2svg]
** [http://www.sodipodi.com/index.php3?section=download/tools ill2svg]
** [http://www.xs4all.nl/~hanwen/public/software/ai2svg.py ai2svg]
** [http://www.accesspdf.com/pdftk/ pdftk]

== Questions/Brainstorms ==

* What about what inkscape earned through the Google Summer of Code? What's the status of this?
** $2000 earned; there has been no plan or consensus for what to use it for
* Does Cairo have PDF export already? What about to use cairo for just this job? and later then use cairo for the whole presentation layer? Instead of creating an interims solution?
** Yes, Cairo has PDF export capabilities; it's unknown if it's significantly better than our current (poor) pdf export functionality
** Cairo Postscript and PDF backends are still experimental and disabled by default in current stable release, but plan is to make them supported in next stable release, expected for the end of 2005. See [http://cvs.cairographics.org/*checkout*/cairo/ROADMAP Cairo ROADMAP]
** A way to test cairo capabilities would be to use librsvg HEAD. See Dom Lachowicz [http://www.advogato.org/person/cinamod/diary.html?start=91 blog entry].
* Investigate ps2ai, pstoedit and ai2svg conversion options (potential EPS support?)
* Import of native Adobe Illustrator files, which have been PDF based since Illustrator 10 (at least).
* Other RFE's related to Import or Export?
* Add extension for use of [http://vdxtosvg.sourceforge.net/ VDX2SVG]
** (This is an unrelated file format... -- Bryce)
* UberConverter

* I'd like to suggest looking at Xpdf or ghostview as possible bases to build a pdftosvg tool with. They both come with command line tools to convert pdf files to other formats. - Ulf Erikson
** This is what we do currently iirc - Bryce
** Uh, okay. I must have missed that. What tool do you use? I know about [http://www.solidcode.net/pdf2svg/ pdf2svg], [http://www.sodipodi.com/index.php3?section=download/tools ill2svg] and [http://www.xs4all.nl/~hanwen/public/software/ai2svg.py ai2svg]. Neither seem to be based on a pdf reader/viewer. I have never tried the (Windows only?) SVG plugin for [http://www.pstoedit.net/pstoedit pstoedit] and the [http://www.eprg.org/projects/SVG/ps2svg/ ps2svg] SVG driver for Ghostscript doesn't seem to be available at all. Anyway, I see now that you list [http://poppler.freedesktop.org/ Poppler] (which a pdf library based on Xpdf) as something worth looking at, so I guess you can remove my comment all together. Let me know if you wish to try my Xpdf code with Poppler. - Ulf (Could we not use the mailing list for discussions?)

Printing consensus poll

2005-12-14T13:02:28Z

BrandonCsSanders: Refactoring

== Problem ==

Bryce has pointed out the #1 feature need for Inkscape right now is strong support for Adobe Portable Document Format (PDF) and Postscript (PS) in his [http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=36054&max_rows=25&style=flat&viewmonth=200511&viewday=30 2005.11.30 email] to the Inkscape mailing lists.
This ConsensusPoll exists to enable the community to efficiently create and commit to a plan of action to resolve this issue.

== Contract ==

* >= 20 inkscape enthusiasts
* >= 4 developers with commit access
* >= 95% yes
* all conditions in plan are met
* 72 hour GO timer
* 80% cloture

ContractExplanation

Because this contract defines what it means to participate in this poll it will never be changed. If it turns out to be inadequate, this poll must be canceled and a new poll with a new contract must be drafted.

== Yes-No Poll ==

Participation in this poll is open to anyone who wants to participate.

Voting yes in this poll means that you believe the community created plan is ready for implementation, and that you will do your part to support its execution. Voting no in this poll means that you have outstanding concerns about the community created plan. You can change your vote at any time. All votes are transparent so that those voting yes can listen to the concerns of those voting no.

No ... BrandonCsSanders - Success needs to be defined (e.g., if all 20 test cases are passed ...)
No ... BryceHarrington - I will pledge $50 once someone defines how we do pledges :-)
No ... AlexandreProkoudine - There is no plan yet
No ... ColinMarquardt - There is no plan yet
No ... EricWilhelm - The plan needs salt
No ... MenTaLguY - This isn't much of a plan...
No ... JonCruz - Plan? Not quite yet
No ... JonPhillips - no plan...
No ... NicuBuculei - so far the plan is weak
No ... RalfWStephan - isolated thoughts don't make a plan, pledge 5% of SoC money amount used for it
No ... AndyFitzsimon - I will also pledge $50 once someone defines how we do pledges.
No ... TuukkaPasanen - There isn't good plan yet.

(If you are voting no because the plan is incomplete, please describe what you'd like to see added or changed.)

== Pledges ==

$50 ... BryceHarrington - I will pledge $50 once someone defines how we do pledges :-)
$50 ... AndyFitzsimon - I will also pledge $50 once someone defines how we do pledges.
??? ... RalfWStephan - pledge 5% of SoC money amount used for it (how much is this?)
$50 ... BrandonCsSanders - once the plan is done

== Plan ==

# Describe the [[Current PDF Support]]
# Identify [[Required PDF Support]]
# Assemble a few dozen examples to use as [[PDF test cases]]
# Determine timeframe
## Start some time in early 2006?
## Expected completion some time in mid/late 2006?
# Select developer with the right skillset
## C/C++, XML
## PDF file format
## SVG file format
## Able to work under (U.S.) contract
## /Other skillset requirements?/
# Determine what funding is needed to enable them to complete the work
# Establish a contract with the selected developer to perform the work
# When the developer is done, verify that all test cases pass, then pay developer

== Background Information ==

* [[SOC_Original_Project_Prompts]]
* PrintingSubsystem
* [[Roadmap]] (Milestone 11) Import/Export Feature Enhancements

== Adequate Technical Solutions ==

What solutions would be fine?
* Library that integrates directly in to inkscape (and scribus, ...)
* Standalone pdf2svg, svg2pdf, ... filter scripts that can be bundled with inkscape
*

(Brandon - what is this section for? -- Bryce)

== Possible Strategies ==

* Raise money and hire a developer to implement it
** Collect pledges, once we are over threshold collect funds (http://fundable.org/)
*** What should the threshhold be? $2000? $5000?
*** Still too early to decide what the threshold should be. We need to know how much it will cost first.
** Need to decide what the funds would be spent on ahead of time
*** 10-20% - Tester to collect test cases and put together a test suite for developer to use
*** 70-80% - Developer to write the code, document it, and make it pass the tests
*** 5-10% - Liaison to handle the paperwork, collect/distribute funds, track/report progress, and verify the work has been completed adequately
** Mercenaries that would do this for us?
*** BrandonCsSanders ... I'd do it for $2000, half up front, half once it meets spec. Caveat: it would take me six months to complete because my plate is pretty full right now and I'll be snatching a week here and a week there.
*** EricWilhelm ... This will be a lovely fit for the UberConverter. I'm guessing $5k would get it to about the same level as XAR and SVG in chromista. Caveat: Those aren't done yet. Check back in Jan. I would also be happy to oversee/direct the work of someone else wanting to write this as a pair of UberConverter connectors (crs2pdf, pdf2crs.)
*** /other mercenaries?/
* Use [[Cairo]] as the presentation layer and use its support for pdf/ps
** See [http://poppler.freedesktop.org/ Poppler] for PDF import.
** This may be a first step towards an eventual migration of the backend renderer to Cairo
* Pull out the scribus pdf support into a libpdf that can be shared by both scribus and Inkscape
** Requires conversion of Qt-isms into more neutral widgetset-independent style
* Extend an existing standalone (filter) tool
** [http://scratchcomputing.com/projects/uber-converter/ Uberconverter]
** [http://www.solidcode.net/pdf2svg/ pdf2svg]
** [http://www.sodipodi.com/index.php3?section=download/tools ill2svg]
** [http://www.xs4all.nl/~hanwen/public/software/ai2svg.py ai2svg]
** [http://www.accesspdf.com/pdftk/ pdftk]

== Questions/Brainstorms ==

* What about what inkscape earned through the Google Summer of Code? What's the status of this?
** $2000 earned; there has been no plan or consensus for what to use it for
* Does Cairo have PDF export already? What about to use cairo for just this job? and later then use cairo for the whole presentation layer? Instead of creating an interims solution?
** Yes, Cairo has PDF export capabilities; it's unknown if it's significantly better than our current (poor) pdf export functionality
** Cairo Postscript and PDF backends are still experimental and disabled by default in current stable release, but plan is to make them supported in next stable release, expected for the end of 2005. See [http://cvs.cairographics.org/*checkout*/cairo/ROADMAP Cairo ROADMAP]
** A way to test cairo capabilities would be to use librsvg HEAD. See Dom Lachowicz [http://www.advogato.org/person/cinamod/diary.html?start=91 blog entry].
* Investigate ps2ai, pstoedit and ai2svg conversion options (potential EPS support?)
* Import of native Adobe Illustrator files, which have been PDF based since Illustrator 10 (at least).
* Other RFE's related to Import or Export?
* Add extension for use of [http://vdxtosvg.sourceforge.net/ VDX2SVG]
** (This is an unrelated file format... -- Bryce)
* UberConverter

* I'd like to suggest looking at Xpdf or ghostview as possible bases to build a pdftosvg tool with. They both come with command line tools to convert pdf files to other formats. - Ulf Erikson
** This is what we do currently iirc - Bryce
** Uh, okay. I must have missed that. What tool do you use? I know about [http://www.solidcode.net/pdf2svg/ pdf2svg], [http://www.sodipodi.com/index.php3?section=download/tools ill2svg] and [http://www.xs4all.nl/~hanwen/public/software/ai2svg.py ai2svg]. Neither seem to be based on a pdf reader/viewer. I have never tried the (Windows only?) SVG plugin for [http://www.pstoedit.net/pstoedit pstoedit] and the [http://www.eprg.org/projects/SVG/ps2svg/ ps2svg] SVG driver for Ghostscript doesn't seem to be available at all. Anyway, I see now that you list [http://poppler.freedesktop.org/ Poppler] (which a pdf library based on Xpdf) as something worth looking at, so I guess you can remove my comment all together. Let me know if you wish to try my Xpdf code with Poppler. - Ulf (Could we not use the mailing list for discussions?)

Required PDF Support

2005-12-14T12:42:59Z

BrandonCsSanders: Refactoring

This page is part of the PrintingConsensusPoll.

# What level of Support/features are required?
# What SVG features must be supported beyond the basics?
# Should the deliverable be a library, a stand alone tool, or ...?
# Other questions about requirements?

This page identifies exactly what sort of PDF support Inkscape needs. This information is essential to complete the plan for the PrintingConsensusPoll.

* Arbitrary .pdf and .ps files can be opened or imported directly into an inkscape document in exactly the way that .svg files are imported.
** All shapes are editable
** All text is rendered in the same font as the original .pdf
** All text is appropriately sequential (multi-column pdfs are handled correctly)
** Arbitrary "page to import" is selectable for multi-page documents.
* Arbitrary .svg files can be "saved as" .pdf files
** What does the .pdf rendering model have that .svg does not?
** What does the .svg rendering model have that .pdf does not?
** Perhaps you would like to help EricWilhelm fill-out this table: [http://scratchcomputing.com/projects/uber-converter/chromista_features.html xar/svg/ps/pdf/crs features] (contact me to get the YAML source)
* Hyperlinks in the PDF file are preserved in the SVG.
* Exporting the SVG to .png produces a pixel accurate ...
* ... please refactor and refine ...

== What Users Need from Inkscape PDF/PS Support ==

* SVG canvas size needs to be compatible with PDF canvas
* Color SVG's get turned black and white on export; needs to preserve colors
* Better gradient supports. Xara Xtreme does a nice trick with gradients by creating colored steps aligned to the shape/direction of the gradient.
* Better AI support. The Adobe Illustrator file format is a PDF-based format (after version 7), or postscript (before version 7). If Inkscape gains good PDF/PS support, it should also be able to load/save AI files.
* Support for alpha transparency everywhere (objects, gradient stops, etc.)
* Ability to tile one large image across multiple pages (cf. KDEPrint's poster utility http://printing.kde.org/downloads/)
* /What else?/

PDF Test Cases

2005-12-14T12:38:59Z

BrandonCsSanders: refactoring

This page is part of the PrintingConsensusPoll. Please link sample PDF's here, that Inkscape currently cannot handle.

* brisgeek.com example [http://brisgeek.com/files/example.svg svg] [http://brisgeek.com/files/example.pdf pdf] [http://brisgeek.com/files/example.eps eps] [http://brisgeek.com/files/example.ps ps]

Printing consensus poll

2005-12-14T12:34:17Z

BrandonCsSanders: *

== Problem ==

Bryce has pointed out the #1 feature need for Inkscape right now is strong support for Adobe Portable Document Format (PDF) and Postscript (PS) in his [http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=36054&max_rows=25&style=flat&viewmonth=200511&viewday=30 2005.11.30 email] to the Inkscape mailing lists.
This ConsensusPoll exists to enable the community to efficiently create and commit to a plan of action to resolve this issue.

== Contract ==

* >= 20 inkscape enthusiasts
* >= 4 developers with commit access
* >= 95% yes
* all conditions in plan are met
* 72 hour GO timer
* 80% cloture

ContractExplanation

Because this contract defines what it means to participate in this poll it will never be changed. If it turns out to be inadequate, this poll must be canceled and a new poll with a new contract must be drafted.

== Yes-No Poll ==

Participation in this poll is open to anyone who wants to participate.

Voting yes in this poll means that you believe the community created plan is ready for implementation, and that you will do your part to support its execution. Voting no in this poll means that you have outstanding concerns about the community created plan. You can change your vote at any time. All votes are transparent so that those voting yes can listen to the concerns of those voting no.

No ... BrandonCsSanders - There is no plan yet
No ... BryceHarrington - I will pledge $50 once someone defines how we do pledges :-)
No ... AlexandreProkoudine - There is no plan yet
No ... ColinMarquardt - There is no plan yet
No ... EricWilhelm - The plan needs salt
No ... MenTaLguY - This isn't much of a plan...
No ... JonCruz - Plan? Not quite yet
No ... JonPhillips - no plan...
No ... NicuBuculei - so far the plan is weak
No ... RalfWStephan - isolated thoughts don't make a plan, pledge 5% of SoC money amount used for it
No ... AndyFitzsimon - I will also pledge $50 once someone defines how we do pledges.
No ... TuukkaPasanen - There isn't good plan yet.

(If you are voting no because the plan is incomplete, please describe what you'd like to see added or changed.)

== Plan ==

# Describe the [[Current PDF Support]]
# Identify [[Required PDF Support]]
# Assemble a few dozen examples to use as [[PDF test cases]]
# Determine timeframe
## Start some time in early 2006?
## Expected completion some time in mid/late 2006?
# Select developer with the right skillset
## C/C++, XML
## PDF file format
## SVG file format
## Able to work under (U.S.) contract
## /Other skillset requirements?/
# Determine what funding is needed to enable them to complete the work
# Establish a contract with the selected developer to perform the work
# When the developer is done, verify that all test cases pass, then pay developer

== Background Information ==

* [[SOC_Original_Project_Prompts]]
* PrintingSubsystem
* [[Roadmap]] (Milestone 11) Import/Export Feature Enhancements
* [http://scratchcomputing.com/projects/uber-converter/ Uberconverter]
* [http://poppler.freedesktop.org/ Poppler] for PDF import.

== Adequate Technical Solutions ==

What solutions would be fine?
*

(Brandon - what is this section for? -- Bryce)

== Possible Strategies ==

* Raise money and hire a developer to implement it
** Collect pledges, once we are over threshold collect funds (http://fundable.org/)
*** What should the threshhold be? $2000? $5000?
** Need to decide what the funds would be spent on ahead of time
*** 10-20% - Tester to collect test cases and put together a test suite for developer to use
*** 70-80% - Developer to write the code, document it, and make it pass the tests
*** 5-10% - Liaison to handle the paperwork, collect/distribute funds, track/report progress, and verify the work has been completed adequately
** Mercenaries that would do this for us?
*** BrandonCsSanders ... I'd do it for $2000, half up front, half once it meets spec. Caveat: it would take me six months to complete because my plate is pretty full right now and I'll be snatching a week here and a week there.
*** EricWilhelm ... This will be a lovely fit for the UberConverter. I'm guessing $5k would get it to about the same level as XAR and SVG in chromista. Caveat: Those aren't done yet. Check back in Jan. I would also be happy to oversee/direct the work of someone else wanting to write this as a pair of UberConverter connectors (crs2pdf, pdf2crs.)
*** /other mercenaries?/
* Use [[Cairo]] as the presentation layer and use its support for pdf/ps
** See poppler
** This may be a first step towards an eventual migration of the backend renderer to Cairo
* Pull out the scribus pdf support into a libpdf that can be shared by both scribus and Inkscape
** Requires conversion of Qt-isms into more neutral widgetset-independent style
* PDF2SVG (http://www.solidcode.net/pdf2svg/)
* [http://www.accesspdf.com/pdftk/ pdftk]?
* /other strategies?/

== Questions/Brainstorms ==

* What about what inkscape earned through the Google Summer of Code? What's the status of this?
** $2000 earned; there has been no plan or concensus for what to use it for
* Does Cairo have PDF export already? What about to use cairo for just this job? and later then use cairo for the whole presentation layer? Instead of creating an interims solution?
** Yes, Cairo has PDF export capabilities; it's unknown if it's significantly better than our current (poor) pdf export functionality
** Cairo Postscript and PDF backends are still experimental and disabled by default in current stable release, but plan is to make them supported in next stable release, expected for the end of 2005. See Cairo ROADMAP: http://cvs.cairographics.org/*checkout*/cairo/ROADMAP
** A way to test cairo capabilities would be to use librsvg HEAD. See Dom Lachowicz blog entry http://www.advogato.org/person/cinamod/diary.html?start=91 .
* Investigate ps2ai, pstoedit and ai2svg conversion options (potential EPS support?)
* Import of native Adobe Illustrator files, which have been PDF based since Illustrator 10 (at least).
* Other RFE's related to Import or Export?
* Add extension for use of VDX2SVG (http://vdxtosvg.sourceforge.net/)
** (This is an unrelated file format... -- Bryce)
* UberConverter

* I'd like to suggest looking at Xpdf or ghostview as possible bases to build a pdftosvg tool with. They both come with command line tools to convert pdf files to other formats. - Ulf Erikson
** This is what we do currently iirc - Bryce
** Uh, okay. I must have missed that. What tool do you use? I know about [http://www.solidcode.net/pdf2svg/ pdf2svg], [http://www.sodipodi.com/index.php3?section=download/tools ill2svg] and [http://www.xs4all.nl/~hanwen/public/software/ai2svg.py ai2svg]. Neither seem to be based on a pdf reader/viewer. I have never tried the (Windows only?) SVG plugin for [http://www.pstoedit.net/pstoedit pstoedit] and the [http://www.eprg.org/projects/SVG/ps2svg/ ps2svg] SVG driver for Ghostscript doesn't seem to be available at all. Anyway, I see now that you list [http://poppler.freedesktop.org/ Poppler] (which a pdf library based on Xpdf) as something worth looking at, so I guess you can remove my comment all together. Let me know if you wish to try my Xpdf code with Poppler. - Ulf (Could we not use the mailing list for discussions?)

Required PDF Support

2005-12-14T12:33:38Z

BrandonCsSanders: Refactoring

# What is level of Support/features are required?
# What SVG features must be supported beyond the basics?
# Should the deliverable be a library, a stand alone tool, or ...?
# Other questions about requirements?

This page identifies exactly what sort of PDF support Inkscape needs. This information is essential to complete the plan for the PrintingConsensusPoll.

* Arbitrary .pdf and .ps files can be opened or imported directly into an inkscape document in exactly the way that .svg files are imported.
** All shapes are editable
** All text is rendered in the same font as the original .pdf
** All text is appropriately sequential (multi-column pdfs are handled correctly)
** Arbitrary "page to import" is selectable for multi-page documents.
* Arbitrary .svg files can be "saved as" .pdf files
** What does the .pdf rendering model have that .svg does not?
** What does the .svg rendering model have that .pdf does not?
** Perhaps you would like to help EricWilhelm fill-out this table: [http://scratchcomputing.com/projects/uber-converter/chromista_features.html xar/svg/ps/pdf/crs features] (contact me to get the YAML source)
* Hyperlinks in the PDF file are preserved in the SVG.
* Exporting the SVG to .png produces a pixel accurate ...
* ... please refactor and refine ...

== What Users Need from Inkscape PDF/PS Support ==

* SVG canvas size needs to be compatible with PDF canvas
* Color SVG's get turned black and white on export; needs to preserve colors
* Better gradient supports. Xara Xtreme does a nice trick with gradients by creating colored steps aligned to the shape/direction of the gradient.
* Better AI support. The Adobe Illustrator file format is a PDF-based format (after version 7), or postscript (before version 7). If Inkscape gains good PDF/PS support, it should also be able to load/save AI files.
* Support for alpha transparency everywhere (objects, gradient stops, etc.)
* Ability to tile one large image across multiple pages (cf. KDEPrint's poster utility http://printing.kde.org/downloads/)
* /What else?/

PDF Support

2005-12-14T12:29:49Z

BrandonCsSanders: Disambiguation page

* [[Current PDF Support]]
* [[Required PDF Support]]

Required PDF Support

2005-12-14T12:29:05Z

BrandonCsSanders: from PDF Support

This page identifies exactly what sort of PDF support Inkscape needs. This information is essential to complete the plan for the PrintingConsensusPoll.

* Arbitrary .pdf and .ps files can be opened or imported directly into an inkscape document in exactly the way that .svg files are imported.
** All shapes are editable
** All text is rendered in the same font as the original .pdf
** All text is appropriately sequential (multi-column pdfs are handled correctly)
** Arbitrary "page to import" is selectable for multi-page documents.
* Arbitrary .svg files can be "saved as" .pdf files
** What does the .pdf rendering model have that .svg does not?
** What does the .svg rendering model have that .pdf does not?
** Perhaps you would like to help EricWilhelm fill-out this table: [http://scratchcomputing.com/projects/uber-converter/chromista_features.html xar/svg/ps/pdf/crs features] (contact me to get the YAML source)
* Hyperlinks in the PDF file are preserved in the SVG.
* Exporting the SVG to .png produces a pixel accurate ...
* ... please refactor and refine ...

== What Users Need from Inkscape PDF/PS Support ==

* SVG canvas size needs to be compatible with PDF canvas
* Color SVG's get turned black and white on export; needs to preserve colors
* Better gradient supports. Xara Xtreme does a nice trick with gradients by creating colored steps aligned to the shape/direction of the gradient.
* Better AI support. The Adobe Illustrator file format is a PDF-based format (after version 7), or postscript (before version 7). If Inkscape gains good PDF/PS support, it should also be able to load/save AI files.
* Support for alpha transparency everywhere (objects, gradient stops, etc.)
* Ability to tile one large image across multiple pages (cf. KDEPrint's poster utility http://printing.kde.org/downloads/)
* /What else?/

Printing consensus poll

2005-12-14T12:28:32Z

BrandonCsSanders: Moving PDF support to Required PDF Support

== Problem ==

Bryce has pointed out the #1 feature need for Inkscape right now is strong support for Adobe Portable Document Format (PDF) and Postscript (PS) in his [http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=36054&max_rows=25&style=flat&viewmonth=200511&viewday=30 2005.11.30 email] to the Inkscape mailing lists.
This ConsensusPoll exists to enable the community to efficiently create and commit to a plan of action to resolve this issue.

== Contract ==

* >= 20 inkscape enthusiasts
* >= 4 developers with commit access
* >= 95% yes
* all conditions in plan are met
* 72 hour GO timer
* 80% cloture

ContractExplanation

Because this contract defines what it means to participate in this poll it will never be changed. If it turns out to be inadequate, this poll must be canceled and a new poll with a new contract must be drafted.

== Yes-No Poll ==

Participation in this poll is open to anyone who wants to participate.

Voting yes in this poll means that you believe the community created plan is ready for implementation, and that you will do your part to support its execution. Voting no in this poll means that you have outstanding concerns about the community created plan. You can change your vote at any time. All votes are transparent so that those voting yes can listen to the concerns of those voting no.

No ... BrandonCsSanders - There is no plan yet
No ... BryceHarrington - I will pledge $50 once someone defines how we do pledges :-)
No ... AlexandreProkoudine - There is no plan yet
No ... ColinMarquardt - There is no plan yet
No ... EricWilhelm - The plan needs salt
No ... MenTaLguY - This isn't much of a plan...
No ... JonCruz - Plan? Not quite yet
No ... JonPhillips - no plan...
No ... NicuBuculei - so far the plan is weak
No ... RalfWStephan - isolated thoughts don't make a plan, pledge 5% of SoC money amount used for it
No ... AndyFitzsimon - I will also pledge $50 once someone defines how we do pledges.
No ... TuukkaPasanen - There isn't good plan yet.

(If you are voting no because the plan is incomplete, please describe what you'd like to see added or changed.)

== What Users Need from Inkscape PDF/PS Support ==

: Moved to [[PDF support]]

== Plan ==

# Describe the [[Current PDF Support]]
# Identify requirements
## What level of [[Required PDF Support]]/features is required?
## What SVG features must be supported beyond the basics?
## Should the deliverable be a library, a stand alone tool, or ...?
## /Other questions about requirements?/
# Assemble a few dozen examples to use as [[PDF test cases]]
## http://brisgeek.com/files/example.svg , http://brisgeek.com/files/example.pdf , http://brisgeek.com/files/example.eps , http://brisgeek.com/files/example.ps
## /Please link sample PDF's here, that Inkscape currently cannot handle/
# Determine timeframe
## Start some time in early 2006?
## Expected completion some time in mid/late 2006?
# Select developer with the right skillset
## C/C++, XML
## PDF file format
## SVG file format
## Able to work under (U.S.) contract
## /Other skillset requirements?/
# Determine what funding is needed to enable them to complete the work
# Establish a contract with the selected developer to perform the work
# When the developer is done, verify that all test cases pass, then pay developer

== Background Information ==

* [[SOC_Original_Project_Prompts]]
* PrintingSubsystem
* [[Roadmap]] (Milestone 11) Import/Export Feature Enhancements
* [http://scratchcomputing.com/projects/uber-converter/ Uberconverter]
* [http://poppler.freedesktop.org/ Poppler] for PDF import.

== Adequate Technical Solutions ==

What solutions would be fine?
*

(Brandon - what is this section for? -- Bryce)

== Possible Strategies ==

* Raise money and hire a developer to implement it
** Collect pledges, once we are over threshold collect funds (http://fundable.org/)
*** What should the threshhold be? $2000? $5000?
** Need to decide what the funds would be spent on ahead of time
*** 10-20% - Tester to collect test cases and put together a test suite for developer to use
*** 70-80% - Developer to write the code, document it, and make it pass the tests
*** 5-10% - Liaison to handle the paperwork, collect/distribute funds, track/report progress, and verify the work has been completed adequately
** Mercenaries that would do this for us?
*** BrandonCsSanders ... I'd do it for $2000, half up front, half once it meets spec. Caveat: it would take me six months to complete because my plate is pretty full right now and I'll be snatching a week here and a week there.
*** EricWilhelm ... This will be a lovely fit for the UberConverter. I'm guessing $5k would get it to about the same level as XAR and SVG in chromista. Caveat: Those aren't done yet. Check back in Jan. I would also be happy to oversee/direct the work of someone else wanting to write this as a pair of UberConverter connectors (crs2pdf, pdf2crs.)
*** /other mercenaries?/
* Use [[Cairo]] as the presentation layer and use its support for pdf/ps
** See poppler
** This may be a first step towards an eventual migration of the backend renderer to Cairo
* Pull out the scribus pdf support into a libpdf that can be shared by both scribus and Inkscape
** Requires conversion of Qt-isms into more neutral widgetset-independent style
* PDF2SVG (http://www.solidcode.net/pdf2svg/)
* [http://www.accesspdf.com/pdftk/ pdftk]?
* /other strategies?/

== Questions/Brainstorms ==

* What about what inkscape earned through the Google Summer of Code? What's the status of this?
** $2000 earned; there has been no plan or concensus for what to use it for
* Does Cairo have PDF export already? What about to use cairo for just this job? and later then use cairo for the whole presentation layer? Instead of creating an interims solution?
** Yes, Cairo has PDF export capabilities; it's unknown if it's significantly better than our current (poor) pdf export functionality
** Cairo Postscript and PDF backends are still experimental and disabled by default in current stable release, but plan is to make them supported in next stable release, expected for the end of 2005. See Cairo ROADMAP: http://cvs.cairographics.org/*checkout*/cairo/ROADMAP
** A way to test cairo capabilities would be to use librsvg HEAD. See Dom Lachowicz blog entry http://www.advogato.org/person/cinamod/diary.html?start=91 .
* Investigate ps2ai, pstoedit and ai2svg conversion options (potential EPS support?)
* Import of native Adobe Illustrator files, which have been PDF based since Illustrator 10 (at least).
* Other RFE's related to Import or Export?
* Add extension for use of VDX2SVG (http://vdxtosvg.sourceforge.net/)
** (This is an unrelated file format... -- Bryce)
* UberConverter

* I'd like to suggest looking at Xpdf or ghostview as possible bases to build a pdftosvg tool with. They both come with command line tools to convert pdf files to other formats. - Ulf Erikson
** This is what we do currently iirc - Bryce
** Uh, okay. I must have missed that. What tool do you use? I know about [http://www.solidcode.net/pdf2svg/ pdf2svg], [http://www.sodipodi.com/index.php3?section=download/tools ill2svg] and [http://www.xs4all.nl/~hanwen/public/software/ai2svg.py ai2svg]. Neither seem to be based on a pdf reader/viewer. I have never tried the (Windows only?) SVG plugin for [http://www.pstoedit.net/pstoedit pstoedit] and the [http://www.eprg.org/projects/SVG/ps2svg/ ps2svg] SVG driver for Ghostscript doesn't seem to be available at all. Anyway, I see now that you list [http://poppler.freedesktop.org/ Poppler] (which a pdf library based on Xpdf) as something worth looking at, so I guess you can remove my comment all together. Let me know if you wish to try my Xpdf code with Poppler. - Ulf (Could we not use the mailing list for discussions?)

Current PDF Support

2005-12-14T12:27:00Z

BrandonCsSanders: Moved some discussion about the current PDF support here

* I'd like to suggest looking at Xpdf or ghostview as possible bases to build a pdftosvg tool with. They both come with command line tools to convert pdf files to other formats. - Ulf Erikson
** This is what we do currently iirc - Bryce
** Uh, okay. I must have missed that. What tool do you use? I know about [http://www.solidcode.net/pdf2svg/ pdf2svg], [http://www.sodipodi.com/index.php3?section=download/tools ill2svg] and [http://www.xs4all.nl/~hanwen/public/software/ai2svg.py ai2svg]. Neither seem to be based on a pdf reader/viewer. I have never tried the (Windows only?) SVG plugin for [http://www.pstoedit.net/pstoedit pstoedit] and the [http://www.eprg.org/projects/SVG/ps2svg/ ps2svg] SVG driver for Ghostscript doesn't seem to be available at all. Anyway, I see now that you list [http://poppler.freedesktop.org/ Poppler] (which a pdf library based on Xpdf) as something worth looking at, so I guess you can remove my comment all together. Let me know if you wish to try my Xpdf code with Poppler. - Ulf (Could we not use the mailing list for discussions?)

Printing consensus poll

2005-12-14T12:26:22Z

BrandonCsSanders: *

== Problem ==

Bryce has pointed out the #1 feature need for Inkscape right now is strong support for Adobe Portable Document Format (PDF) and Postscript (PS) in his [http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=36054&max_rows=25&style=flat&viewmonth=200511&viewday=30 2005.11.30 email] to the Inkscape mailing lists.
This ConsensusPoll exists to enable the community to efficiently create and commit to a plan of action to resolve this issue.

== Contract ==

* >= 20 inkscape enthusiasts
* >= 4 developers with commit access
* >= 95% yes
* all conditions in plan are met
* 72 hour GO timer
* 80% cloture

ContractExplanation

Because this contract defines what it means to participate in this poll it will never be changed. If it turns out to be inadequate, this poll must be canceled and a new poll with a new contract must be drafted.

== Yes-No Poll ==

Participation in this poll is open to anyone who wants to participate.

Voting yes in this poll means that you believe the community created plan is ready for implementation, and that you will do your part to support its execution. Voting no in this poll means that you have outstanding concerns about the community created plan. You can change your vote at any time. All votes are transparent so that those voting yes can listen to the concerns of those voting no.

No ... BrandonCsSanders - There is no plan yet
No ... BryceHarrington - I will pledge $50 once someone defines how we do pledges :-)
No ... AlexandreProkoudine - There is no plan yet
No ... ColinMarquardt - There is no plan yet
No ... EricWilhelm - The plan needs salt
No ... MenTaLguY - This isn't much of a plan...
No ... JonCruz - Plan? Not quite yet
No ... JonPhillips - no plan...
No ... NicuBuculei - so far the plan is weak
No ... RalfWStephan - isolated thoughts don't make a plan, pledge 5% of SoC money amount used for it
No ... AndyFitzsimon - I will also pledge $50 once someone defines how we do pledges.
No ... TuukkaPasanen - There isn't good plan yet.

(If you are voting no because the plan is incomplete, please describe what you'd like to see added or changed.)

== What Users Need from Inkscape PDF/PS Support ==

: Moved to [[PDF support]]

== Plan ==

# Describe the [[Current PDF Support]]
# Identify requirements
## What level of [[PDF support]]/features is required?
## What SVG features must be supported beyond the basics?
## Should the deliverable be a library, a stand alone tool, or ...?
## /Other questions about requirements?/
# Assemble a few dozen examples to use as [[PDF test cases]]
## http://brisgeek.com/files/example.svg , http://brisgeek.com/files/example.pdf , http://brisgeek.com/files/example.eps , http://brisgeek.com/files/example.ps
## /Please link sample PDF's here, that Inkscape currently cannot handle/
# Determine timeframe
## Start some time in early 2006?
## Expected completion some time in mid/late 2006?
# Select developer with the right skillset
## C/C++, XML
## PDF file format
## SVG file format
## Able to work under (U.S.) contract
## /Other skillset requirements?/
# Determine what funding is needed to enable them to complete the work
# Establish a contract with the selected developer to perform the work
# When the developer is done, verify that all test cases pass, then pay developer

== Background Information ==

* [[SOC_Original_Project_Prompts]]
* PrintingSubsystem
* [[Roadmap]] (Milestone 11) Import/Export Feature Enhancements
* [http://scratchcomputing.com/projects/uber-converter/ Uberconverter]
* [http://poppler.freedesktop.org/ Poppler] for PDF import.

== Adequate Technical Solutions ==

What solutions would be fine?
*

(Brandon - what is this section for? -- Bryce)

== Possible Strategies ==

* Raise money and hire a developer to implement it
** Collect pledges, once we are over threshold collect funds (http://fundable.org/)
*** What should the threshhold be? $2000? $5000?
** Need to decide what the funds would be spent on ahead of time
*** 10-20% - Tester to collect test cases and put together a test suite for developer to use
*** 70-80% - Developer to write the code, document it, and make it pass the tests
*** 5-10% - Liaison to handle the paperwork, collect/distribute funds, track/report progress, and verify the work has been completed adequately
** Mercenaries that would do this for us?
*** BrandonCsSanders ... I'd do it for $2000, half up front, half once it meets spec. Caveat: it would take me six months to complete because my plate is pretty full right now and I'll be snatching a week here and a week there.
*** EricWilhelm ... This will be a lovely fit for the UberConverter. I'm guessing $5k would get it to about the same level as XAR and SVG in chromista. Caveat: Those aren't done yet. Check back in Jan. I would also be happy to oversee/direct the work of someone else wanting to write this as a pair of UberConverter connectors (crs2pdf, pdf2crs.)
*** /other mercenaries?/
* Use [[Cairo]] as the presentation layer and use its support for pdf/ps
** See poppler
** This may be a first step towards an eventual migration of the backend renderer to Cairo
* Pull out the scribus pdf support into a libpdf that can be shared by both scribus and Inkscape
** Requires conversion of Qt-isms into more neutral widgetset-independent style
* PDF2SVG (http://www.solidcode.net/pdf2svg/)
* [http://www.accesspdf.com/pdftk/ pdftk]?
* /other strategies?/

== Questions/Brainstorms ==

* What about what inkscape earned through the Google Summer of Code? What's the status of this?
** $2000 earned; there has been no plan or concensus for what to use it for
* Does Cairo have PDF export already? What about to use cairo for just this job? and later then use cairo for the whole presentation layer? Instead of creating an interims solution?
** Yes, Cairo has PDF export capabilities; it's unknown if it's significantly better than our current (poor) pdf export functionality
** Cairo Postscript and PDF backends are still experimental and disabled by default in current stable release, but plan is to make them supported in next stable release, expected for the end of 2005. See Cairo ROADMAP: http://cvs.cairographics.org/*checkout*/cairo/ROADMAP
** A way to test cairo capabilities would be to use librsvg HEAD. See Dom Lachowicz blog entry http://www.advogato.org/person/cinamod/diary.html?start=91 .
* Investigate ps2ai, pstoedit and ai2svg conversion options (potential EPS support?)
* Import of native Adobe Illustrator files, which have been PDF based since Illustrator 10 (at least).
* Other RFE's related to Import or Export?
* Add extension for use of VDX2SVG (http://vdxtosvg.sourceforge.net/)
** (This is an unrelated file format... -- Bryce)
* UberConverter

* I'd like to suggest looking at Xpdf or ghostview as possible bases to build a pdftosvg tool with. They both come with command line tools to convert pdf files to other formats. - Ulf Erikson
** This is what we do currently iirc - Bryce
** Uh, okay. I must have missed that. What tool do you use? I know about [http://www.solidcode.net/pdf2svg/ pdf2svg], [http://www.sodipodi.com/index.php3?section=download/tools ill2svg] and [http://www.xs4all.nl/~hanwen/public/software/ai2svg.py ai2svg]. Neither seem to be based on a pdf reader/viewer. I have never tried the (Windows only?) SVG plugin for [http://www.pstoedit.net/pstoedit pstoedit] and the [http://www.eprg.org/projects/SVG/ps2svg/ ps2svg] SVG driver for Ghostscript doesn't seem to be available at all. Anyway, I see now that you list [http://poppler.freedesktop.org/ Poppler] (which a pdf library based on Xpdf) as something worth looking at, so I guess you can remove my comment all together. Let me know if you wish to try my Xpdf code with Poppler. - Ulf (Could we not use the mailing list for discussions?)

PDF Support

2005-12-13T00:33:08Z

BrandonCsSanders: Moved "what users need" into this page

Printing consensus poll

2005-12-13T00:31:26Z

BrandonCsSanders: Fixed link to Bryce's email

== Problem ==

Bryce has pointed out the #1 feature need for Inkscape right now is strong support for Adobe Portable Document Format (PDF) and Postscript (PS) in his [http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=36054&max_rows=25&style=flat&viewmonth=200511&viewday=30 2005.11.30 email] to the Inkscape mailing lists.
This ConsensusPoll exists to enable the community to efficiently create and commit to a plan of action to resolve this issue.

== Contract ==

* >= 20 inkscape enthusiasts
* >= 4 developers with commit access
* >= 95% yes
* all conditions in plan are met
* 72 hour GO timer
* 80% cloture

ContractExplanation

Because this contract defines what it means to participate in this poll it will never be changed. If it turns out to be inadequate, this poll must be canceled and a new poll with a new contract must be drafted.

== Yes/No Poll ==

Participation in this poll is open to anyone who wants to participate.

Voting yes in this poll means that you believe the community created plan is ready for implementation, and that you will do your part to support its execution. Voting no in this poll means that you have outstanding concerns about the community created plan. You can change your vote at any time. All votes are transparent so that those voting yes can listen to the concerns of those voting no.

No ... BrandonCsSanders - There is no plan yet
No ... BryceHarrington - I will pledge $50 once someone defines how we do pledges :-)
No ... AlexandreProkoudine - There is no plan yet
No ... ColinMarquardt - There is no plan yet
No ... EricWilhelm - The plan needs salt
No ... MenTaLguY - This isn't much of a plan...
No ... JonCruz - Plan? Not quite yet
No ... JonPhillips - no plan...
No ... NicuBuculei - so far the plan is weak
No ... RalfWStephan - isolated thoughts don't make a plan, pledge 5% of SoC money amount used for it
No ... AndyFitzsimon - I will also pledge $50 once someone defines how we do pledges.
No ... TuukkaPasanen - There isn't good plan yet.

(If you are voting no because the plan is incomplete, please describe what you'd like to see added or changed.)

== What Users Need from Inkscape PDF/PS Support ==

* SVG canvas size needs to be compatible with PDF canvas
* Color SVG's get turned black and white on export; needs to preserve colors
* Better gradient supports. Xara Xtreme does a nice trick with gradients by creating colored steps aligned to the shape/direction of the gradient.
* Better AI support. The Adobe Illustrator file format is a PDF-based format (after version 7), or postscript (before version 7). If Inkscape gains good PDF/PS support, it should also be able to load/save AI files.
* Support for alpha transparency everywhere (objects, gradient stops, etc.)
* Ability to tile one large image across multiple pages (cf. KDEPrint's poster utility http://printing.kde.org/downloads/)
* /What else?/

== Plan ==

# Identify requirements
## What level of [[PDF support]]/features is required?
## What SVG features must be supported beyond the basics?
## Should the deliverable be a library, a stand alone tool, or ...?
## /Other questions about requirements?/
# Assemble a few dozen examples to use as [[PDF test cases]]
## http://brisgeek.com/files/example.svg , http://brisgeek.com/files/example.pdf , http://brisgeek.com/files/example.eps , http://brisgeek.com/files/example.ps
## /Please link sample PDF's here, that Inkscape currently cannot handle/
# Determine timeframe
## Start some time in early 2006?
## Expected completion some time in mid/late 2006?
# Select developer with the right skillset
## C/C++, XML
## PDF file format
## SVG file format
## Able to work under (U.S.) contract
## /Other skillset requirements?/
# Determine what funding is needed to enable them to complete the work
# Establish a contract with the selected developer to perform the work
# When the developer is done, verify that all test cases pass, then pay developer

== Background Information ==

* [[SOC_Original_Project_Prompts]]
* PrintingSubsystem
* [[Roadmap]] (Milestone 11) Import/Export Feature Enhancements
* [http://scratchcomputing.com/projects/uber-converter/ Uberconverter]
* [http://poppler.freedesktop.org/ Poppler] for PDF import.

== Adequate Technical Solutions ==

What solutions would be fine?
*

(Brandon - what is this section for? -- Bryce)

== Possible Strategies ==

* Raise money and hire a developer to implement it
** Collect pledges, once we are over threshold collect funds (http://fundable.org/)
*** What should the threshhold be? $2000? $5000?
** Need to decide what the funds would be spent on ahead of time
*** 10-20% - Tester to collect test cases and put together a test suite for developer to use
*** 70-80% - Developer to write the code, document it, and make it pass the tests
*** 5-10% - Liaison to handle the paperwork, collect/distribute funds, track/report progress, and verify the work has been completed adequately
** Mercenaries that would do this for us?
*** BrandonCsSanders ... I'd do it for $2000, half up front, half once it meets spec. Caveat: it would take me six months to complete because my plate is pretty full right now and I'll be snatching a week here and a week there.
*** EricWilhelm ... This will be a lovely fit for the UberConverter. I'm guessing $5k would get it to about the same level as XAR and SVG in chromista. Caveat: Those aren't done yet. Check back in Jan. I would also be happy to oversee/direct the work of someone else wanting to write this as a pair of UberConverter connectors (crs2pdf, pdf2crs.)
*** /other mercenaries?/
* Use [[Cairo]] as the presentation layer and use its support for pdf/ps
** See poppler
** This may be a first step towards an eventual migration of the backend renderer to Cairo
* Pull out the scribus pdf support into a libpdf that can be shared by both scribus and Inkscape
** Requires conversion of Qt-isms into more neutral widgetset-independent style
* PDF2SVG (http://www.solidcode.net/pdf2svg/)
* [http://www.accesspdf.com/pdftk/ pdftk]?
* /other strategies?/

== Questions/Brainstorms ==

* What about what inkscape earned through the Google Summer of Code? What's the status of this?
** $2000 earned; there has been no plan or concensus for what to use it for
* Does Cairo have PDF export already? What about to use cairo for just this job? and later then use cairo for the whole presentation layer? Instead of creating an interims solution?
** Yes, Cairo has PDF export capabilities; it's unknown if it's significantly better than our current (poor) pdf export functionality
** Cairo Postscript and PDF backends are still experimental and disabled by default in current stable release, but plan is to make them supported in next stable release, expected for the end of 2005. See Cairo ROADMAP: http://cvs.cairographics.org/*checkout*/cairo/ROADMAP
** A way to test cairo capabilities would be to use librsvg HEAD. See Dom Lachowicz blog entry http://www.advogato.org/person/cinamod/diary.html?start=91 .
* Investigate ps2ai, pstoedit and ai2svg conversion options (potential EPS support?)
* Import of native Adobe Illustrator files, which have been PDF based since Illustrator 10 (at least).
* Other RFE's related to Import or Export?
* Add extension for use of VDX2SVG (http://vdxtosvg.sourceforge.net/)
** (This is an unrelated file format... -- Bryce)
* UberConverter

* I'd like to suggest looking at Xpdf or ghostview as possible bases to
build a pdftosvg tool with. They both come with command line tools to
convert pdf files to other formats. - Ulf Erikson
** This is what we do currently iirc - Bryce

Printing consensus poll

2005-12-13T00:26:52Z

BrandonCsSanders: *

== Problem ==

Bryce has pointed out the #1 feature need for Inkscape right now is strong support for Adobe Portable Document Format (PDF) and Postscript (PS) in his [http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=36054&max_rows=25&style=flat&viewmonth=200511&viewday=30 | 2005.11.30] email to the Inkscape mailing lists.
This ConsensusPoll exists to enable the community to efficiently create and commit to a plan of action to resolve this issue.

== Contract ==

* >= 20 inkscape enthusiasts
* >= 4 developers with commit access
* >= 95% yes
* all conditions in plan are met
* 72 hour GO timer
* 80% cloture

ContractExplanation http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?forum_id=36054&max_rows=25&style=flat&viewmonth=200511&viewday=30

Because this contract defines what it means to participate in this poll it will never be changed. If it turns out to be inadequate, this poll must be canceled and a new poll with a new contract must be drafted.

== Yes/No Poll ==

Participation in this poll is open to anyone who wants to participate.

Voting yes in this poll means that you believe the community created plan is ready for implementation, and that you will do your part to support its execution. Voting no in this poll means that you have outstanding concerns about the community created plan. You can change your vote at any time. All votes are transparent so that those voting yes can listen to the concerns of those voting no.

No ... BrandonCsSanders - There is no plan yet
No ... BryceHarrington - I will pledge $50 once someone defines how we do pledges :-)
No ... AlexandreProkoudine - There is no plan yet
No ... ColinMarquardt - There is no plan yet
No ... EricWilhelm - The plan needs salt
No ... MenTaLguY - This isn't much of a plan...
No ... JonCruz - Plan? Not quite yet
No ... JonPhillips - no plan...
No ... NicuBuculei - so far the plan is weak
No ... RalfWStephan - isolated thoughts don't make a plan, pledge 5% of SoC money amount used for it
No ... AndyFitzsimon - I will also pledge $50 once someone defines how we do pledges.
No ... TuukkaPasanen - There isn't good plan yet.

(If you are voting no because the plan is incomplete, please describe what you'd like to see added or changed.)

== What Users Need from Inkscape PDF/PS Support ==

* SVG canvas size needs to be compatible with PDF canvas
* Color SVG's get turned black and white on export; needs to preserve colors
* Better gradient supports. Xara Xtreme does a nice trick with gradients by creating colored steps aligned to the shape/direction of the gradient.
* Better AI support. The Adobe Illustrator file format is a PDF-based format (after version 7), or postscript (before version 7). If Inkscape gains good PDF/PS support, it should also be able to load/save AI files.
* Support for alpha transparency everywhere (objects, gradient stops, etc.)
* Ability to tile one large image across multiple pages (cf. KDEPrint's poster utility http://printing.kde.org/downloads/)
* /What else?/

== Plan ==

# Identify requirements
## What level of [[PDF support]]/features is required?
## What SVG features must be supported beyond the basics?
## Should the deliverable be a library, a stand alone tool, or ...?
## /Other questions about requirements?/
# Assemble a few dozen examples to use as [[PDF test cases]]
## http://brisgeek.com/files/example.svg , http://brisgeek.com/files/example.pdf , http://brisgeek.com/files/example.eps , http://brisgeek.com/files/example.ps
## /Please link sample PDF's here, that Inkscape currently cannot handle/
# Determine timeframe
## Start some time in early 2006?
## Expected completion some time in mid/late 2006?
# Select developer with the right skillset
## C/C++, XML
## PDF file format
## SVG file format
## Able to work under (U.S.) contract
## /Other skillset requirements?/
# Determine what funding is needed to enable them to complete the work
# Establish a contract with the selected developer to perform the work
# When the developer is done, verify that all test cases pass, then pay developer

== Background Information ==

* [[SOC_Original_Project_Prompts]]
* PrintingSubsystem
* [[Roadmap]] (Milestone 11) Import/Export Feature Enhancements
* [http://scratchcomputing.com/projects/uber-converter/ Uberconverter]
* [http://poppler.freedesktop.org/ Poppler] for PDF import.

== Adequate Technical Solutions ==

What solutions would be fine?
*

(Brandon - what is this section for? -- Bryce)

== Possible Strategies ==

* Raise money and hire a developer to implement it
** Collect pledges, once we are over threshold collect funds (http://fundable.org/)
*** What should the threshhold be? $2000? $5000?
** Need to decide what the funds would be spent on ahead of time
*** 10-20% - Tester to collect test cases and put together a test suite for developer to use
*** 70-80% - Developer to write the code, document it, and make it pass the tests
*** 5-10% - Liaison to handle the paperwork, collect/distribute funds, track/report progress, and verify the work has been completed adequately
** Mercenaries that would do this for us?
*** BrandonCsSanders ... I'd do it for $2000, half up front, half once it meets spec. Caveat: it would take me six months to complete because my plate is pretty full right now and I'll be snatching a week here and a week there.
*** EricWilhelm ... This will be a lovely fit for the UberConverter. I'm guessing $5k would get it to about the same level as XAR and SVG in chromista. Caveat: Those aren't done yet. Check back in Jan. I would also be happy to oversee/direct the work of someone else wanting to write this as a pair of UberConverter connectors (crs2pdf, pdf2crs.)
*** /other mercenaries?/
* Use [[Cairo]] as the presentation layer and use its support for pdf/ps
** See poppler
** This may be a first step towards an eventual migration of the backend renderer to Cairo
* Pull out the scribus pdf support into a libpdf that can be shared by both scribus and Inkscape
** Requires conversion of Qt-isms into more neutral widgetset-independent style
* PDF2SVG (http://www.solidcode.net/pdf2svg/)
* [http://www.accesspdf.com/pdftk/ pdftk]?
* /other strategies?/

== Questions/Brainstorms ==

* What about what inkscape earned through the Google Summer of Code? What's the status of this?
** $2000 earned; there has been no plan or concensus for what to use it for
* Does Cairo have PDF export already? What about to use cairo for just this job? and later then use cairo for the whole presentation layer? Instead of creating an interims solution?
** Yes, Cairo has PDF export capabilities; it's unknown if it's significantly better than our current (poor) pdf export functionality
** Cairo Postscript and PDF backends are still experimental and disabled by default in current stable release, but plan is to make them supported in next stable release, expected for the end of 2005. See Cairo ROADMAP: http://cvs.cairographics.org/*checkout*/cairo/ROADMAP
** A way to test cairo capabilities would be to use librsvg HEAD. See Dom Lachowicz blog entry http://www.advogato.org/person/cinamod/diary.html?start=91 .
* Investigate ps2ai, pstoedit and ai2svg conversion options (potential EPS support?)
* Import of native Adobe Illustrator files, which have been PDF based since Illustrator 10 (at least).
* Other RFE's related to Import or Export?
* Add extension for use of VDX2SVG (http://vdxtosvg.sourceforge.net/)
** (This is an unrelated file format... -- Bryce)
* UberConverter

* I'd like to suggest looking at Xpdf or ghostview as possible bases to
build a pdftosvg tool with. They both come with command line tools to
convert pdf files to other formats. - Ulf Erikson
** This is what we do currently iirc - Bryce

ContractExplanation

2005-12-11T04:48:08Z

BrandonCsSanders: mean ==> me

This page explains the contract in the PrintingConsensusPoll.

if
** At least 20 inkscape enthusiasts (including at least 4 developers with CVS commit access) are participating in this poll
** At least 95% of those participating in the poll vote yes
** All conditions in the plan (e.g., minimum $$ pledged) are met
then state = GO

else state = STOP

On the transition from STOP to GO, a 72 hour timer starts counting down to 0. Every time the plan is changed, the timer resets back to 72 hours.

If the timer reaches 0, we're done and we've committed to implementing the plan as described in the "Plan" section of the PrintingConsensusPoll.

: CLOTURE
:: In the unlikely event that cloture is needed to halt a filibuster, 80% of all participants must agree to lock the plan to a particular version. To hold a cloture vote, the poll must be in the GO state. Once a cloture vote succeeds, no further cloture votes can succeed. On the transition from GO to STOP all cloture results and/or votes are deleted.

----

Please feel warmly welcomed to refactor this into a clearer explanation. All edits (including by me) will be considered "efficiently expressed suggestions". Clobber away :) -- BrandonCsSanders

ContractExplanation

2005-12-11T04:47:25Z

BrandonCsSanders: Help this become clearer.

This page explains the contract in the PrintingConsensusPoll.

if
** At least 20 inkscape enthusiasts (including at least 4 developers with CVS commit access) are participating in this poll
** At least 95% of those participating in the poll vote yes
** All conditions in the plan (e.g., minimum $$ pledged) are met
then state = GO

else state = STOP

On the transition from STOP to GO, a 72 hour timer starts counting down to 0. Every time the plan is changed, the timer resets back to 72 hours.

If the timer reaches 0, we're done and we've committed to implementing the plan as described in the "Plan" section of the PrintingConsensusPoll.

: CLOTURE
:: In the unlikely event that cloture is needed to halt a filibuster, 80% of all participants must agree to lock the plan to a particular version. To hold a cloture vote, the poll must be in the GO state. Once a cloture vote succeeds, no further cloture votes can succeed. On the transition from GO to STOP all cloture results and/or votes are deleted.

----

Please feel warmly welcomed to refactor this into a clearer explanation. All edits (including by mean) will be considered "efficiently expressed suggestions". Clobber away :) -- BrandonCsSanders

PDF Support

2005-12-11T04:41:02Z

BrandonCsSanders: A _very_ incomplete start

Printing consensus poll

2005-12-11T04:29:06Z

BrandonCsSanders: Links to pages to begin creating detailed plan

== Problem ==

Bryce has pointed out that good PDF/PS support is the #1 feature need for Inkscape right now (in his 2005.11.30 email to the inkscape lists). This ConsensusPoll exists to enable the community to efficiently create and commit to a plan of action to resolve this issue.

== Contract ==

* >= 20 inkscape enthusiasts
* >= 4 developers with commit access
* >= 95% yes
* all conditions in plan are met
* 72 hour GO timer
* 80% cloture

ContractExplanation

Because this contract defines what it means to participate in this poll it will never be changed. If it turns out to be inadequate, this poll must be canceled and a new poll with a new contract must be drafted.

== Yes/No Poll ==

Participation in this poll is open to anyone who wants to participate.

Voting yes in this poll means that you believe the community created plan is ready for implementation, and that you will do your part to support its execution. Voting no in this poll means that you have outstanding concerns about the community created plan. You can change your vote at any time. All votes are transparent so that those voting yes can listen to the concerns of those voting no.

No ... BrandonCsSanders - There is no plan yet
No ... BryceHarrington - The plan is not fully baked
No ... AlexandreProkoudine - There is no plan yet
No ... ColinMarquardt - There is no plan yet
No ... EricWilhelm - The plan needs salt
No ... MenTaLguY - This isn't much of a plan...
No ... JonCruz - Plan? Not quite yet
No ... JonPhillips - no plan...
No ... NicuBuculei - so far the plan is weak

== Plan ==

* Identify exactly what sort of [[PDF support]] is required
* Collect a few dozen examples to use as [[PDF test cases]]
* Decide the best strategy for achieving this PDF support
* Find a developer with the right skillset for implementing the strategy
* Determine what funding is needed to enable them to complete the work
* Establish a contract with the selected developer to perform the work
* When the developer is done, verify that all test cases pass, then pay developer
* If this process was successful in meeting our needs, and if new needs are identified, repeat this process again

== Background Information ==

* [[SOC_Original_Project_Prompts]]
* PrintingSubsystem
* [[Roadmap]] (Milestone 11) Import/Export Feature Enhancements
* [http://scratchcomputing.com/projects/uber-converter/ Uberconverter]
*

== Adequate Technical Solutions ==

What solutions would be fine?

== Possible Strategies ==

* Raise money and hire a developer to implement it
** Collect pledges, once we are over threshold collect funds (http://fundable.org/)
** Need to decide what the funds would be spent on ahead of time
** Mercenaries that would do this for us?
*** BrandonCsSanders ... I'd do it for $2000, half up front, half once it meets spec. Caveat: it would take me six months to complete because my plate is pretty full right now and I'll be snatching a week here and a week there.
*** EricWilhelm ... This will be a lovely fit for the UberConverter. I'm guessing $5k would get it to about the same level as XAR and SVG in chromista. Caveat: Those aren't done yet. Check back in Jan. I would also be happy to oversee/direct the work of someone else wanting to write this as a pair of UberConverter connectors (crs2pdf, pdf2crs.)
*** /other mercenaries?/
* Use [[Cairo]] as the presentation layer and use its support for pdf/ps
* Pull out the scribus pdf support into a libpdf that can be shared by both scribus and Inkscape
* /other strategies?/

== Questions/Brainstorms ==

* What about what inkscape earned through SoC? What's the status of this?
** $2000 earned; there has been no plan or concensus for what to use it for
* Does Cairo have pdf export already? What about to use cairo for just this job? and later then use cairo for the whole presentation layer? Instead of creating an interims solution?
** Yes, Cairo has pdf export capabilities; it's unknown if it's significantly better than our current (poor) pdf export functionality
* Investigate ps2ai, pstoedit and ai2svg conversion options (potential EPS support?)
* Import of native Adobe Illustrator files
* Other RFE's related to Import/Export?
* Add extension for use of VDX2SVG (http://vdxtosvg.sourceforge.net/)
* Add extension for use of PDF2SVG (http://www.solidcode.net/pdf2svg/)
* UberConverter

Printing consensus poll

2005-12-08T02:14:27Z

BrandonCsSanders: link to Uberconverter

BrandonCsSanders

2005-12-06T21:55:12Z

BrandonCsSanders: About brandon

I'm an Inkscape enthusiast (and evangelist) who has been a user since well before the fork. I live in the same city as Bryce and have been chatting with him about ways to get involved in the development. You can find more info about me on [http://brandon-cs-sanders.com/ my portal page].

Printing consensus poll

2005-12-06T21:52:28Z

BrandonCsSanders: A community developed plan to add PDF/PS support to Inkscape.

ContractExplanation

2005-12-06T21:47:05Z

BrandonCsSanders: This page explains the contract in the PrintingConsensusPoll